In closing -
April 3, 2001 - Chris Jones
Disclaimer: The opinions expressed
within this column are those of the participants and the
moderator, and do not necessarily reflect those of the
GIA. There is coarse language and potentially offensive
material afoot.
The world's most advanced operating system? We'll see...
Don't say we didn't warn you.
A couple of people sent us emails about someone borrowing a fairly major
story from us and not giving credit. Our unofficial take on the matter
is "ha, they got burned, serves them right", but our official take is:
"The GIA takes issues of sourcing seriously because credibility is all any
news outlet really has. It doesn't demean a site at all to give proper credit,
as no site can possibly unearth every relevant story by themselves. We discover
sites on a regular basis that steal our content, and we can usually resolve
things in a friendly way."
"As for the recent incident, the GIA has been assured that a junior staffer
was responsible for the story theft while the news editor was in Japan covering
the Tokyo Game Show. We're confident it was an anomaly."
"We also occasionally
discover smaller sites which steal our content repeatedly, ranging from the FFX scoop
to mundane release date stories. All we have to say is that it does no site any good to
steal the content of others - it is a reputation for quality that builds hits, and any short term hits
gained by theft are vastly outweighed by a severe drop in that reputation."
And hopefully that's sufficient word on the matter.
Also, there're no detailed spoilers in today's column, but major plot points
are mentioned in passing for the following games: FF 4-9, FFT, Majora's
Mask, MGS, and Vagrant Story.
Onward.
| A non-trivial problem |
| Endings. You're asking for it this time, Chris. Everyone hates endings,
especially to RPGs. I don't think we'll ever, ever see an RPG ending that
appeals to a majority of gamers.
Part of this, I think, is because endings always seem rushed. Maybe it's
just me, but the endings of RPGs always seem crammed with crap that the
developers couldn't find a reasonable way to fit in in the first 35 hours of
the game. So when it ends, it's after a 10-minute series of revelations that
could fill a novel. A lot of games seem to end abruptly.
The other part is the time investment. After playing a game for forty hours,
you become engrossed in it. All the characters are your best friends, their
problems your problems, their world your world. I think a lot of people just
don't want to see the game end at all. No ending can successfully complete
months' worth of gaming.
Short action games? No problem. Nobody complains about the ending to Contra.
-Eightball
P.S. Okay, Fallout's an exception. </shamelessFalloutplug> I couldn't
resist, man! |
I don't think it's impossible to end a game successfully, but you're probably right that no one ending will satisfy everyone... but then, no game has yet satisfied everyone yet either. The one requirement I have for an ending is that it wrap up the point of the game - it's not required that the fate of all the characters be known, or that things end up particularly happy or sad, but there's no point in playing a 30 hour game if nothing gets resolved. Problem is, there's a lot of room to satisfy those criteria and still end up with something that lots of people despise, as we'll see.
| Tying up all the loose
ends |
| Endings haven't gotten better or worse with time. Some have probably
gotten longer and "flashier", like SM 64 when compared to SMB... But I
digress.
Still, there's something that RPGs give and take away from time to
time. Look at FF4... You get to see a little of what they were up to
when they returned from the Moon. Then look at FF6. They get away in the
airship... So?! What did happened to them? What about Relm and Strago
and Shadow? And Gau and the rest of the cast? What did Terra do
after.....?
Let's not even mention FF7. That was probably done on purpose to
fuel fanfics until the end of time. FF8 had a more clear ending: They're
teens, they party; Rinoa and Squall continue loving each other...
Although you can't help but wonder if Ultimecia was a K-accented Rinoa
from the future, you get more closure than FF7.
So, I don't care if the game has a super-mega-happy ending with a
stupid cake, or if in the end you realize all you did was wrong and evil
(at least that's the guilt trip Illusion of Gaia seemed to try to
instill); above all give me closure. Don't sacrifice closure for an
enigmatic ending that makes the whole story more interesting. It
doesn't.
P. S.: Oh, I also hated Majora's Mask. Did Link forgot about Navi all of
a sudden?! At least the same scene from the beginning, with Link looking
for Navi through the Lost Woods once again would have been nice.
|
MM's a legit complaint, because the original point of the whole story gets completely left behind. But having everything wrapped up in a neat little package all the time gets tedious - things aren't like that in real life, and doing so can take away from the actual point of the conclusion. Final Fantasy 7's ending gets a lot of crap because it left so much up in the air, but when all was said and done, the story really was about if the planet would survive or not. The ending cleared that up: at least one good guy lived, the bad guys were punished, end of story. And letting people speculate on what might happen next isn't always a bad thing.
| Keeping in tune with
the rest of the story |
| On the topic of endings, simple and happy vs. complex and bittersweet,
well... My two favorite video game endings ever are FFV and Vagrant
Story. They have absolutely nothing in common, except that they fit the
mood of the rest of the game perfectly. FFV's characters and plot were
for the most part light-hearted and simple with a dash of wistfulness,
and so was the ending. Most satisfying and fitting FF ending to date, in
my opinion. (But then again, since I actually liked FFV a great deal,
that probably means my opinion is worthless.) Likewise, VS's characters
and plot were incredibly subtle and mostly tragic. The ending was so
much in tune with that sentiment that it depressed me more than any
event in any video game has depressed me before. And I *loved* it.
Some games deserve the complex endings you see so often lately. But
given a cheerful, light-hearted game, I'd rather have an ending that
went along well with it than a bunch of stuff tossed in to try to meet
some kind of standard for modern games' endings. FFIX makes a good
example here; overall, FFIX's ending wasn't much different from the
endings of your standard SNES RPGs, except that it had a nicer script
and translation. It strikes me as a perfectly suitable ending to a
modern RPG (which FFIX is, despite the retro designs)... except that
after the final boss, I was expecting a little more explanation. But
ignore the final boss, and it was a great ending for the game, "happily
ever after" or not, because FFIX was a relatively straight-forward fairy
tale adventure.
-Andrea Hartmann, who still needs to see the bit with the hammer one of
these days...
|
This is, of course, absolutely key - super happy games deserve a super happy ending, complex, murky games deserve a complex, murky ending, and truly epic titles deserve... well, you get the idea. Dewprism's ending, for example, gave everyone what they deserved, and that made the whole play experience doubly worthwhile. Even MGS's dual endings fit in well with the various themes of revenge/war/love scattered throughout the game. A lighthearted game where things got complex and taciturn at the end (a la The Princess Bride - the book, mind you) might be amusing in principle, but it'd feel like a letdown after a while. Ditto a complex game where everything was solved too easily. Let's be honest - after everything that happened in FFT, it wouldn't have felt right to have Ramza marry the princess and live happily ever after, right?
| Complexity is a good
thing |
| Endings - Better or Worse? I would have to say worse. There has been far
too much use of the standard japanese RPG plots and endings (say, FF2, any
Wild ARMS title, Grandia 2, and so on). Xenogears took it a step farther,
with the "lets not discuss that" method, essentially jumping to the
credits.
The shakespearean finish to FFT (my pick for best ending) is essentially the
only one of its kind (on a console platform), and thats a pretty sorry
statement for today's storylines.
Wake up, read Alan Moore's Watchmen, and bloody well make an interesting
ending that you can't describe in detail before playing Disc 1. Otherwise,
its going to be very difficult to justify a 40-60 hour RPG anymore.
KZ |
Keeping in line with Andrea's letter, I don't think it's enough to want more complex endings, you have to have more complex games as well. Nothing wrong with that, but that's not traditionally what RPGs have been about: their purpose has mainly been escapism, and their endings have echoed that. But by now I'm ready to do more than just rescue the princess, and I agree that an ending should be giving us more than that.
| Ashley's princess is
in another castle! |
| hey there Chrisy,
First off I'd like to take offense at your comment on a 'sequel to Xenogears,
"In my opinion, they're selling themselves short by selling themselves on the
merits of their past work, instead of what they might be able to do starting
from scratch." Now mind you, I didn't much like Xenogears. I got bored and
quit before I even got to the second disk. But it's just stupid to say story writers
are 'selling themselves short' by continuing a story. It was clear since the XG
Perfect Works that the whole XG story has been thought up for a long time.
Would you say "J.R.R. Tolkien is selling himself short by making the Lord
Of The Rings in the same world as The Hobbit," or "Why is Spielberg making
'Empire Strikes Back,' a sequel to 'A New Hope' instead of something new?"
No! Sometimes a story is meant to be told in its entirety.
And as for endings, for the most part they've improved since the 16-bit days.
And I think all that's important for an ending to be good is for it to match
the rest of the story; if you played till the end, you've liked what you were
getting. The endings for FFT and VS were excellent, because they fit right in
with the themes of their storylines. If Ashley had found out Sydney was his brother,
Married Callo, and became king, people would've been pissed. But similarly, if the
Super Mario RPG had ended with Mario stabbing peach and then waxing philosophical,
the kiddies would've been lost. It's all in the floooow, man.
-Lardlad
|
The key difference between Tolkien or Lucas (not Spielberg) and the Xenogears team is that Tolkien and Lucas both own their stories, and were able to fully flesh them out as they saw fit - not true of the Xenogears producers. A better analogy might be if J. Michael Straczynski had been fired from Babylon 5 around season 2 or 3, and had gone on to create a show called "Babel 7". And I hate to break it to you, but Xenogears does work as a stand alone piece - yes, there are holes to fill in, but they wouldn't do much more than reinforce the conclusion that we've already seen. You can make the same argument about the new Star Wars too, and I won't argue against it.
| Byron begin again |
sincerely,
Lord Byron
Really now, in some games you can see the endings a mile away: I felt Grandia
had an especially obvious plot. In others, it's designed that way
(Mario..Zelda...). But this isn't about how a plot may be delivered, it's
about the actual end. Let's steer clear of Chrono Cross' end though, shall
we? I'll take a couple of mainstream examples, your self mentioned Final
Fantasy Tactics, and Final Fantasy 8 (though I am no longer certain that that
many people have beaten the game). FF8 had the happy "everyone becomes happy
and all buddy buddy, the bad guys are redeemed, and the main hero gets the
girl." FFT had a much more obscure ending, with a less happy tone. However,
Ramza and his sister "return from the dead," which did brighten it.
Personally (and that's what this is about), my favorite sorts of endings tend
towards the kind that do not have so happy an ending, but rather a satisfying
feeling. As long as I can feel that my character accomplished something of
extreme importance, I don't need a happy happy ending. I prefer the darker,
more mysterious and slightly open ended stance to game endings. Perfect
example is Vagrant Story. Dark ending, but wholly satisfying, and more
importantly (especially for companies) it made me want more. I want those
kind of endings, or at the very least some variation. I know there's only so
much a person can write about, but at least cycle it. You don't always have
to get the girl, try and redeem the villain, or even save the world from
complete destruction. But perhaps what I'm looking for is more believable
anti-heroes. Endings should always come down to the actions and personality
of the character, not just what would appeal to the audience. So that's my
thought.
Dear Chris,
|
The problem with saying "here's what I feel like giving you, nuts to the audience" is that sooner or later you may not have an audience left. Deus ex machina endings are often looked down on, but let's be honest - when they work, there's few things that match the joy of watching things turn completely around, the good guys win, the bad guys lose, and everything come out ok. I don't want that all the time, but there's little point in playing games if all we ever have are flawed, human characters always ending up in flawed, human situations.
| The root of the problem |
| 4 problems with the endings of games:
Ambiguity - ambiguity is VERY BAD! There needs to be some closure and
explanation of a story that you've been wrapped up in for 40 hours. Leaving
the player with a bunch of mumbo jumbo and a question mark just makes them
mad.
Insult to intelligence - A "wrapped up in a neat little package" ending
where everyone lives happily ever after makes you feel like you're playing a
game made for little children. Things don't ever turn out that way.
Tragedy - If an ending is completely tragic, the player will feel like
they've wasted their time with a 40 hour quest. Why fight so long and hard
to then have your character fail in the end? (this one is very rare, but I
thought I'd include it anyway)
Lack of substance - This one is also viewed by the player as a waste of 40
hours. To play a long RPG and then be "treated" to a 2-minute ending that
doesn't do the rest of the game justice.
We don't ask much, if developers can avoid these four pitfalls, gamers will
be satisfied with the ending to a game.
|
Agreed... not with your actual 4 problems, but with your real point, that most of those things are mutual contradictions. But we expect miracles from our writers, and well we should - if you can't get a miracle fix from fantasy, what's the damn point?
Closing Comments:
I'd like to do a ZOE topic soon, hopefully by next week. Meantime, try this on for size - ZOE's an amazing game, but at some level it still all boils down to fetch quests stuck in there to drive along the mech combat and storyline. Are we forever doomed to work with game structure not much different from what was on the NES, or what? Later.
-Chris Jones, wants all endings to be accompanied by Toy Story 2-style outtakes
|
