Instant Karma -
February 9, 2001 - Chris Jones
Disclaimer: The opinions expressed
within this column are those of the participants and the
moderator, and do not necessarily reflect those of the
GIA. There is coarse language and potentially offensive
material afoot.
I can hear the marchin' band, doin' the best they can, they play "Smoke
on the Water", "Joy to the World".
Don't say we didn't warn you.
For most of the day I was contemplating one of my usual topics -
namely, how to humiliate and defeat Mr. Jeremy Parish in our friendly
contest to destroy the other's soul and scatter the burnt
ashes into the wind.
But then I remembered that, thanks to JP's odd sense of humor and
self-deprecating nature, he's already won the battle for me, and all I have
to do is point it out.
All too easy.
Onward.
| Yes, but this one's a
blue goblin, you see... |
| Hey Chris,
A couple letters yesterday really agreed with my own thoughts: the Lunar 2
rant, and Red Raven's suggestion to eliminate or limit battles. Both of
these letters reminded me of an opinion I've had recently about "monsters"
in RPGs.
After all these years playing RPGs, seeing a new monster in battle just
doesn't have the same effect anymore. I used to be impressed by these
fantastical beasts, and yearned to destroy them. All I see now is some
randomly created thing that I'm supposed to hack at. I'm sure that many of
you will agree with me on this.
This could be remedied in a couple of ways, I think. First, a more diverse
cast of monsters could be created, rather than recolouring and renaming a
small set to death. Secondly, the number of battles could be limited to
only a few key battles, while also limiting the amount of monsters so that
each monster receives a more significant degree of importance. Lastly,
allow for more variation within a species of monster. One goblin could be
anorexic, another clumsy, maybe one even friendly. Here's hoping we see
more battles that are NOT regularly fought with only half of your attention
and repetitive strategy.
There's some more details I'd like to add, but lack the time at the moment.
Maybe you can expand on this.
-Steve Tran, would rather challenge a monster to a round of improv comedy
than just kill it |
Sounds about right. Before we trash talk Lunar, I would like to point
out that if memory serves, the original Sega CD Lunar was noteworthy
because it had no color-switched monsters, and may be one of the
only games ever to accomplish this task.
And there's a ton of ways to make monsters more interesting, but I
think they'll all boil down to two things: making the battles more
involved, and making the battles fewer in number. These are horrible
slavering beasts, so dispatching them shouldn't be less interesting than
slapping Tetris blocks together. Making monsters more differentiated and
colorful would also be a good start, because as it is now, I don't think
anyone actually cares about monsters, except in the sense that they're a
few extra GP or EXP for your stats.
And your last comment reminds me for some reason of the final battle in
Stephen King's "It", where the hero and the demon bite down on each other's
tongues and tell jokes until one of them laughs. (Ok, that's a
misrepresentation, but I don't want to spoil things.) It's a totally insane
idea, but monsters are not supposed to be warm and cuddly creatures -
maybe that's more the kind of thinking we need in RPGs.
| Seeing what's not there |
| Here's an odd thought- RPG players seem to like to
assume that the PSX generation of RPGs was chock-full of religious commentary
and symbolism. Maybe not well done commentary and symbolism, but commentary
and symbolism nonetheless.
The odd thing is, I don't see it. I see plenty of allusions to various religions,
such as naming characters and monsters with names taken from various religions
(Sephiroth, Deus, FF summons), but actual symbolism seems hard to come
by (expect maybe while fighting final bosses). It's the same with commentary-
religions are involved in some games' plots, but actual commentary is pretty much
non-existent. Even in Final Fantasy Tactics it's a bit of a stretch to say that religious
commentary was in any way the main thrust of the story- and FFT is a pretty extreme
example of a religion being involved in the main plot.
So...maybe all this discussion about religion in gaming is just gamers taking
games too seriously, while often at the same time mocking the games for their
perceived seriousness. Stranger things have happened.
Davon
|
"It was symbolic of something. No one could quite say what, but
definitely symbolic."
-Terry Pratchett, Small Gods
If we get too much into this, we hit the brick wall of "art is in the
eye of the beholder" and "if I can get all this meaning out of it, who's
to say it's not really there?" My personal spin is somewhere in the
middle - Final Fantasy Tactics, for example, was definitely not saying
nice things about the Catholic Church in the Middle Ages, but I don't
think they were trying to trash all religion, and I don't even think they
were trying to be taken all that seriously. It's just a fantasy role
playing game, when all's said and done.
In general I do agree that a lot
of Japanese works tend to take bits from Western religion and mythology
completely out of context and lose whatever made them interesting in the
first place, but it's not like we've never done the same to them. And you
could equally well argue that the Japanese, by virtue of not
seeing things the same way we do, manage to find new things to say. I
can't really disprove that, but it's a real stretch to find meaning in
the crucifixion of a giant pink bunny-thing.
And that's all I have to say about that.
| A great evil is abroad
in the world |
| I'm the person who liked disc 2 of Xenogears, in addition to all that
other evil stuff I like and have mentioned before.
*-LS-*
who is just waiting for the general topic of conversation to turn to
tentacle hentai, so she can tell you what she thinks of that, too... ^_^ |
Look, some people really, really liked Xenogears disc 2, there's no
denying it. I'm not speaking out against anyone thinking it's great, I'm
just saying that for everyone, me included, there's a line where there's
too much story and not enough control. And disc 2 was it for me.
And nobody's discussing hentai under my watch - come on, I have
some principles. I'm just amazed that the mere existence of crap
like that hasn't caused all the women in the world to rise up and
summarily execute all the men for crimes against humanity.
| Smashed to pieces |
| Hey Chris, when I bought my Dreamcast the other day I noticed that my smash
pack disc is labeled "Sega Smash Pack Volume 1". This suggests there may
be a volume 2! Has any such thing been announced? I'd really love a
chance to get Phantasy Star 3 and/or 4, not to mention some other games
like Sonic 2 and maybe Ecco the Dolphin.
David
|
I got no info about this, and my net access is too curtailed at the
moment to do any research. Anyone want to give an answer here?
| PC Data |
| Chris,
I just wanted to comment on your response about PC adventure games.
First, while graphic adventures did make less money than PC games due to
there being fewer PCs, graphic adventures did well in the PC market. It
was mostly the advent of 3D that killed adventure games. First person
shooters, third person games like Tomb Raider, and real time strategy took
over the market. Faced with this, the big players in the graphic adventure
field either branched out to other genres or adapted their adventure games
to 3D, like LucasArts did with Grim Fandango and the last two Monkey Island
games, or failed to adapt to 3D and collapsed, like Sierra did with the
last King's Quest game. Before this, however, they did quite well selling
graphic adventures.
I also wanted to respond to your statement that they didn't sell well due
to not being playable on the control pad. While you are correct in saying
that control pads were not suited to these games, they did quite well with
other inputs. While early games did require to you type things like
"LOOK IN TREE" to solve puzzles, by the 90s, most of these games used a
very intuitive mouse system. LucasArts's SCUMM system in particular is still,
in my opinion, a better control system than many games released today. The
PC has a much larger array of input devices available to it, so I don't know
why you would think that adventure games makers would want to limit themselves
to a very limited input device.
Finally, the best adventure games have just as strong of an element of
exploration and storytelling s the best RPGs. While some adventure games
were mostly puzzles with little story, there are many console RPGs that
are endless battles with little story. I still consider the story of
"Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis" to be one of the best stories
told in a video game, for instance, just as I've enjoyed the stories in
games like Xenogears. And the more I think about it, puzzles in adventure
games serve the same purpose as battles in a console RPG - they're something
that challenges the gamer while they are in the process of exploring the
world and uncovering the story of the game.
The markets for PC games and console games are very different. While there
people who enjoy both fields, in general, they appeal to different people.
While comparisons can be made, there's no easy way to really say that one
genre is better or sold better than the other due to single factors.
Personally, I think it's better to just play what you like, and forget
about all these comparisons.
Brian Sebby
|
No argument here, except that, yes, Brian, it really does boil down
to economic factors. The PCs almost always the better games machine to
develop on going by technical factors, but even if a PS2 costs $300, if
a heavy duty PC costs 2 grand, which platform do you think is gonna be
more widespread? Every time I've talked to a PC game developer in
person, and mentioned that I tend to prefer consoles, they've said
"Man, we'd love to develop for a console, we'd sell so many more
games." But they don't because they don't have the resources, or the
connections, or consoles won't allow them the creative and technical
freedom to do what they want.
Other than that, I'm not arguing against the value of adventure games,
but I will say that, at least in my mind, they have a different focus
than RPGs, perhaps because of their various ancestries. The very first
console RPGs had graphics and towns and far flung locations - low
resolution as all of it was, you wanted to see more of the world.
Adventure games clearly evolved out of those old Infocom text adventures,
which had nothing in the way of graphics, little in the way of
conversation, and were often nothing more than intricate item puzzles
strung together. Not that they weren't great (Planetfall... mmm) but there
just wasn't the same thrill of getting to "Admin Corridor B" as there was
in getting to the Desert Tower.
| Paper Dragoon Saga |
| Chris,
Sorry about the paper-less day... I had written a letter. I guess it just got miss-sent,
oh well. Anyways, I perchased Paper Mario on Tuesday and have been having a ball
with it ever since. Unlike the original Square Mario RPG, which while a really good RPG
and game, always felt like an overly cute-ifed FF to me, PM Feels much more like a
Mario game. The levels are laid out in the same fashion as the 2D Mario games of old
down to the brick blocks hanging in mid air that may just yeild a coin or power-up. The
platforming aspects are very intuitive thanks to the side view perspective. The battles
are more involved then most RPG's, you actually have to think about what you are going
to attack and how, as it will have a drastic impact on the battle. Think of the way that
Panzer Dragoon Saga kept you on you toes by having you constantly work on the various
forms of a attack and movement during battle and you have a good idea of the battles in
PM.The various helpers with their unique talents and abilities add even more strategy
and tactics to the battles as well as and almost Zelda like side-guest system. Much like
Zelda, although the progression through the game is fairly linear, there are always other
stuff to do and accomplish. While the story's nothing to write home about (Mario gets to
save the princess again! Oh the over whellming joy.... \ :| ... ) much as done in Skies of
Arcadia, it's just so well written and wounderfully translated that it just cool by shear
force of personality alone.
Beyond even these standard RPG concerns the rest of the game stands up
quite well. Visually speaking, the unique 2D/3D look is pulled off extremely well
with colorful and wounderous sights all around. The music is typical Mario fare, but well
done in a variety of styles (they even tossed in a couple tango's and more then a few
calypso tunes). The references to past Mario games are cool and usually quite
humorous (Watch were Mario lands after being tossed out of the castle by Browser in
the opening. Look familiar?). The control is even spot on in the usually Nintendo
way.
With all this PM love going on, even I know this game doesn't belong in the same
category as FF, Crono Cross/Trigger, S of A, and other such "traditional" RPGs. I just
feel that much like the PD RPG, it's so unusual and unique in the way it does things,
that it's short-comings ( not exactly the world's most gripping plot and shock inducingly
sweet to name a couple) are far over shadowed by it's strengths. Hopefully people will
be able to get over the cuteness of it all and just enjoy it for the excellent
game that it is.
Matt B.
|
Interesting... not having had a chance to play it myself, I can't
much comment, but it occurs to me that between this and the upcoming Mario
GBA title, we may be seeing the last of the classic Mario 2D platformers,
since Game Cube Mario looks to be something completely different. So if
that's your thing, get it while you can.
| Charity case |
| Dammit. Everytime a good looking RPG comes out, I usually don't have the
console needed to play it. My SNES kicked the bucket before Chrono Trigger
and Super Mario RPG. I don't have the money, so I can't play Grandia 2 or
Skies of Arcadia. And, to top things off, my N64's gone, just about the time
when, of all things, Paper Mario comes out. Dammit. I want Paper Mario!
-LP
PS, I would get emulators, but, like, my computer's almost out of power. So,
yeah.
|
This letter brings up something that always amazes me: people who
pay obsessive attention to games, and yet don't own any, and don't even
have a system to play them on. I see it all the time when I mention I
write a letters column - people will say "Oh, so you talk about Chrono
Trigger? I love that game!" "Ah, you still play Chrono Trigger?" "No, I
only played it once four years ago at a friends house, but it's still
a great game. I'd love to play the sequel." "Ah, so you have a PSX?"
"No, but I might get one someday, when the price goes down more."
I just don't get it... but I did have a bizarre idea that might help.
On the off chance that the site ever starts raking it in (say, about the
same time hell freezes over and Yamauchi gets a Square logo tattooed on
his forehead) we should set up a charity for economically disadvantaged
RPG players and wannabe players. After all, nearly everyone's undergone
the hardship of not being able to play what they want when they want, and
what better way to promote peace and understanding than by spreading
around the joy of RPGs where you routinely cleave monsters in two and
battle marauding demons?
Closing Comments:
Drew is back, so send him
lots of email or else I'll slap you around. And since Drew has
returned, I feel like I should give him a nice, divisive topic - ok,
lessee, would you rather developers made new games, or direct sequels
to old ones? In other words, Should Matusno direct FFXII, with brand
new characters and controls, or should he make FFT2, starting where the
last one left off? Heck, you can even salivate (or trash) the idea of a follow-up to FF6 if you want. So tell Drew, because I wouldn't touch that topic with
a 20 foot pole. Later.
-Chris Jones, wondering if
this indignity will finally land me a mention in the Webcomix
|
