Double Agent
Strange attractors - February 14, 2001 - Chris Jones

Disclaimer: The opinions expressed within this column are those of the participants and the moderator, and do not necessarily reflect those of the GIA. There is coarse language and potentially offensive material afoot. I'm drivin' a big lazy car, rushin' up the highway in the dark, I got one hand steady on the wheel, and one hand's tremblin' over my heart. Don't say we didn't warn you.

Two thanks to the good folks over at Penny Arcade today, the first for their kind words and link to the GIA. I'd like to do the usual kowtow and insist that we're not worthy, but... ah, screw it, we are worthy, we rule, and that's all there is to it. Recognition from major cultural icons is simply our just deserts.

Second, they pointed out some very interesting stories about possible changes as to how games are marketed, which would make a great rant for intro, but a better topic for tomorrow. And besides, it's a big col today, so I need to get started.

Onward.

In the beginning...
CJ,

Bad romances in RPG's? Dragon Warrior. Rescue the princess. Then you get a question with a choice.

Princess: Dost thou love me?
Warrior: No.
Princess: But thou must...
Princess: Dost thou love me?
Warrior: No!
Princess: But thou must...
Dost thou love me?
Warrior: OH HELL NO!!!!!!!!!!!
Princess: But thou must...
Dost thou love me?
Warrior: yes......

I know, limitations of the day, yadda yadda, but it's still annoying.

-JD

I know it's cliche to ask, but what kind of self-image problems would a woman have to have to keep throwing herself at a man like that? Plus he's an Akira Toriyama-designed man, which means he's doomed to have his hair turn blonde and engage in slow-motion fights for everlasting peace. Best to steer well clear, I say.

Stock answer
When I think of bad RPG romances, the first thing that comes to mind is Final Fantasy VIII. My problem was simple: Squall was a complete asshole. This guy is supposed to be my alter ego in the game, and yet he acts like a complete jerk for no apparent reason. That part was irritating enough, but far more irritating was the fact that Rinoa still falls in love with him. So basically we have a love story about an ideal RPG heroine getting together with an obnoxious teenage twit - not exactly my idea of a perfect romance. Final Fantasy IX was really refreshing to me, not because I liked Zidane all that much, but just because he hit on the attractive young woman in the party instead of totally blowing her off.

David

Ok, yes, lots of people don't like Squall and Rinoa's romance, fine, I won't argue the point today. Moving on.

He's very immature for his age
Chris,

Nice topic, easy answer. Although I haven't played as many games across the years as many people in this column have (just been obsessed with the ones I do possess from the past couple of years), I can answer your question with two words and a pretty symbol: Justin & Feena. I'm sure this particular example will be brought up numerous times, and so I don't expect mine to be the special letter of choice, but I think that this is the most glaring example of a "huh?" rpg romance I've experienced (not necessarily what's out there.) There was a large, and in my opinion inapproriate shift during the game, which left the innocent youngin' of Justin behind for the romantic if awkward teen, without much explanation, and left no room that I could see for such a shift to have occured within a person like Justin. There is no way on earth that a child of his age and experience could be acting the way he did in the latter half of the game. At least given the scenarios. Now....had Justin been an adult teen (which, by the way, I think make fine heros for games. It's all about target audience. Look at literature for reference.) it could have worked. As it is, he should have played more the little brother than romantic interest.

Lord Byron
(who thinks that the characters in Grandia and Lunar 2 are scarily similar looking)

I was actually having a discussion about this recently, and someone pointed out that Justin's supposed to be 14 and Feena's supposed to be 15 - but as you say, they don't nearly act like it. I had Justin pegged for about 12 for most of the game, and Feena at right around 17 or 18, from both how they looked and how they acted. I tended to think that Justin and Sue would have made a good couple... in about 10 years. As it is, the romance felt like it was shoehorned in just because all RPGs have to have a romance in there somewhere, and it's never good to see a game bend to convention like that.

It's important to measure him against the competition
I realize it's not always an RPG but,

Mario and the Princess. Sure he's saved her time and time again but c'mon. She's royalty, he's a plumber. In some versions she's been quite hot, Mario has not, not ever.

Then again compared to Toad and the other toadstools I guess he's a he-man.
Y@

Yep... let's think about this for a moment. From all available evidence, Peach's suitors are limited to a bunch of squat, helpless, turbaned guys, a large lizard/turtle thing who continuously abducts her and sticks her in some stone dungeon, and an odd, but human-looking and fairly capable plumber. If you were in her position, who would you take? I think as long as Mario can keep her away from other humanoids, like Link or even Samus Aran, he'll remain her number one squeeze.

I'm not sure where patriotism creeped in to this, but what the heck
Chris Jones:

In yesterday's column you made the comment, "...[Teenagers are] too busy just trying to figure themselves out to save anyone." I would just like to mention that many of the soldiers in the enlisted ranks of our military are teenagers (either 18 or 19). During World War II, you could say that the 'world was saved' thanks in no small part to the efforts of thousands of teenagers fighting for the allies in Europe and the Pacific. So please, give a little respect to the countless number of teenagers in our armed forces still actively preparing to be able to 'save the world' at a moments notice, should the need ever arise.

Respectfully,
Eric Reichel

You put me in an awkward position here, Eric, partially by removing the part of the quote where I said that the occasional teenager might be strong enough to get the job done. And indeed, there are clearly standouts of young men all throughout history who have risen to greatness, despite being less than 20 years old.

On the other hand, it's also the case that not every teenager in the armed forces is a David Hackworth waiting to happen. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to belittle their achievements (they're doing more than I've ever done, I freely admit) but the fact of the matter is that at that age, the military is valuable precisely because it instills character and discipline, not because it allows teenagers to stand tall and singlehandedly save the world. Insofar as anyone did singlehandedly save the world in WW2, it tended to be much older guys like Churchhill, who wrestled with dramatic RPG-worthy issues like Coventry, instead of Saving Private Ryan-type issues like "get across this field without being cut in two by machine gun fire." Both require heroism, but only one requires true emotional maturity - the other just requires lots of luck and a fast crawl.

A man who knows where his towel... er, mag, is
Hi Chris,

I read your comment about the speed of the modem vs broadband. There are not any noticable differences during the game itself. However, if your leader has broadband, those load times for a new player to join your game are drastically reduced. Normally one can wait up to a minute if the host has a slow connection, but with the BBA, it's rarely more than seven seconds, typically less.

Not a huge advantage unless you're in a busy game with lots of people coming and going. it has happened on occasion, and waiting for one join after another can just draw the fun out of the adventure.

-- FireMyst => "Mysty", level 44, HUnewearl
PSO fanatic

Thanks for the heads up, Myst. Somebody also pointed out that a lot of modem connections are prone to disconnects, which are much less likely on a dedicated line.

FF8 revisited
I know I am probably not the first person to say this, but I really hated the "relationship" between Squall and Quistis. There were a few key scenes where Quistis let her feelings be known and then once Rinoa came on the scene, nothing. Where are the violent battles between two rivals? When I'm given a love triangle, I want BLOOD SPILLED! Otherwise, what is the point?

Even if they avoided direct confrontation, I would have liked an expanation of why Quistis was so blase about Rinoa stepping in. She seemed just as determined to get Rinoa and Squall together as the other members of the cast, which struck me as odd.

I'm not even going to get into the disgustingly sappy relationship between Squall and Rinoa herself. I'm sure people will be lining up to rip that one to shreds.

Washington Irving, hitting all the obvious targets.

Quistis is yet another sore point for a lot of folks, but this time around I don't mind making a quick argument as to why I thought her actions made sense. When she initially approaches Squall, she's upset and vulnerable over losing her job - she wants a shoulder to cry on, and Squall fails that test. Badly. Quistis struck me as the most emotionally mature of the whole group, which meant she'd be the first to realize there was no future there and give up on Squall completely.

Rinoa, on the other hand, was a lot less mature, and had other kinds of baggage associated with her relationship with Seifer... she probably got a foolish schoolgirl crush on Squall, but wasn't smart enough to give up on him. Like I've always said, it's not that FF8 has bad relationships, it's that they require a little more examination than we're used to in RPG world.

End of rant.

Don't all blonde schitzos want to date Mr. T?
My mind just can't get past the idea that you can date Barret in FF7. Now there's a romance I can't see happening.

I hear it's a platonic night out though. Phooey.

-Davon

ps- I knew we had roughly similar tastes, but you somewhat suprised me by giving exactly the same answers I would have in responce to mista tea's question.

Cloud. Barrett. What else is there to say?

Who could resist that tongue? *FF9 spoilers*
Much maligned Mr. Jones,

Vivi and Quina. They got married, so they must have been in love!

....

*shudder*

- Mr. Nip (first comes looooooooove, then comes... wait, I know this...)

Huh... you don't suppose that's where Vivi's "sons" came from, do you?

*shudder*

His name's Cecil. Enough said.
This was probably Nintendo's fault more than anything, but the love of Cecil and Rosa in the US FF4 gets my vote as worst RPG romance.

#1: Cecil was a male chauvenist pig with his,"No you be woman no fight with me" OVER AND OVER again.

#2: Nil development as a couple that was interesting. Cecil and Rosa remained the same throughout the game.

#3: "You haven't quite been yourself lately." WTF!!?? That remark came out of nowhere!

I know this mail sounds silly, and I do myself. What I'm really coming down to is Final Fantasy 4 had the worst English RPG translation of all time, and EVERYBODY had bad dialouge. God, it gives me nightmares...

Adrian Ripburger (Console RPG players should be given kudos if they know what game my signature is form)

If you look at Cecil and Rosa's relationship as something that had been ongoing for years, rather than something that's just starting up, then a lot of that goes away - the overprotectiveness, the tendency towards action rather than flowery speeches, the determination on her part to track him down, they all make sense. Bad translation or no, it was a great game for the time and still holds up pretty well.

And your name is kinda tricky... you'd really have to search full throttle to figure that one out.

Travesty done right, Genesis style
Alright, I've got a definite stinker for you. It's a bit old, but I imagine you'll be getting a flood of anti-FFVIII stuff to deal with, so a little old-school wouldn't hurt. For the stupidest, most cliched RPG "romance," I'd have to turn to Shining Force II, in which the hero ends up with a woman he's never met before--an utterly generic, stereotyped Princess In Distress and a distinct lack of personality--instead of the girl that apparently loves him and has been with you the entire game. He even wakes up the intended with a kiss. *Ugh* If ever there was a retread in the videogame business, this was it.

Nick Z.

Not having played the game, I'll take your word on it. Thanks for the info.

Love blooms on the battlefield, despite your best efforts to the contrary
*MGS spoilers*
Chris:

Since everyone and their dog is probably going to write in about <insert any Final Fantasy couple here>, I figure I'll choose good old Snake and Meryl.

It ruined one of my favorite daydreams--you know the one where I am a bad-ass superspy, heart of cold steel, go-to guy whenever a lunatic tries to ransom the world with a nuclear enabled--by implying that some random woman could melt my icy heart, just by making a nuisance of herself in my general direction.

--DarkLao

P.S. Not really, but it was rather a stretch, I think

Heck yes - I couldn't see what the heck Snake was thinking with regard to Meryl, not when someone like Mei Ling was available. Heck, even Sniper Wolf and Naomi were better prospects, despite their repeated attempts to kill him. Love truly is blind, I think.

And just to clear this up
"Tomorrow is Valentine's Day, and although I can't quite summon up the usual amount of bile for a "holiday" that's little more than an excuse for card companies, florists and candy makers to sell tons of useless junk..."

Let me guess, Chris, you're single?

-J

Amazingly enough, no - I'm as surprised as you are, but I am not single on this particular Valentine's Day. In fact, I'm so loopy for this woman that I voluntarily wrote her a love sonnet, iambic pentameter and all. (And she liked it, by all accounts, which is when I personally start listening for Rod Serling doing a voiceover, given my history with women.)

Still, doesn't mean I can't make an accurate assessment that today is a marketing push first and a holiday second... but for all of you lucky enough to be in a relationship at the moment, happy VD.

Wait, that's not right...

Closing Comments:

I hope you all read that IDSA document that Mr. Tycho linked to, because there's a test on it tomorrow. Or a topic at least. Tell me if you have any thoughts as to this change in the weather regarding M-rated games, and I'll talk to you tomorrow.

-Chris Jones, has his head in the clouds, world on a string, etc.

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