Be careful not to meet yourself in time - February 7th, 2000 - Drew Cosner
Disclaimer: The opinions expressed within this column are those of the participants and the moderator, and do not neccessarily reflect those of the GIA. There is coarse language and potentially offensive material afoot. The end is nigh? Don't say we didn't warn you.
You know, I sometimes wonder why developers even bother with plots that revolve around time travel. For years after the title's release, people dwell on the inherent conundrums and point out the fallacies in the game's logic. The only work ever to take time travel on in a mature and thoughtful manner befitting such a complex subject has been the Back to the Future trilogy. For example, don't run into yourself or everything goes to hell; If you mess up the past you have until your photograph fades to undo the damage. Sure, these were probably cheap cop-outs, but you don't see people getting into heated debates over why Marty and the Doc were able to exist in the present if they did this and that in the past and such. But no, game developers have to make everything complex. Even Square. Which leads right into today's column, so get reading; just try to avoid anyone with the last name of Tannen.
By the way, there's tons of FFVIII spoilers in today's column, so if you've still as of yet to beat the game, I guess you're out of luck. Get your ass away from the computer and finish the damned game, already.
Incompleters |
Someone tell Glick he isn't alone in his procrastination. Let me reveal
something about myself...
I have never beaten an Final Fantasy game other than FF8.
I'm not even going to try to explain, but know that I own FF1, FF4, FF6,
FF7, FFT, and FFMQ as well as FF8.
That is all. Well, wait, does anyone else beside me and Big Lick suffer
from this disorder? There, that's all.
~Ian P.
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You know, everyone loses interest in some games. Every gamer is guilty of this. I'm a huge platforming fan, yet I've been dragging my feet while playing Donkey Kong 64, and it's doubtful that I'll ever complete the game. But considering that you have to shell out 50 bucks for a game, it's generally not a good practice to do so.
Now, I could understand if you'd not completed perhaps one game in the series, Ian, but what's the deal? Didn't your parents teach you the value of money? Or are you so rich that you can sit in your mountain command center carved in the likeness of your own effigy, giggling as you play 5 minutes of the latest titles, only to toss them into the trash mere moments later? Seriously, though, I've always gotten so wrapped up in the storyline with FF games that I lose sleep playing almost non-stop until I make it to the end. It's sad, but it's what I do. So I suppose I can't appreciate what it is to be like yourself or Mister Glick. Sorry, I'm just lame like that.
The return of Mao (Warning: mild Chrono Cross spoilers) |
Okay, off topic. Deal. Drew, ask Vestal, or whoever else has played the
damn game, to set my worries to rest. Is there a replacement Magus,
someone to fill the badass anti-hero role our favorite blue-haired
wizard left vacant in Chrono Cross? I suppose asking for the real Janus
would be too much, but as long as someone is there to fill his most
righteous codpiece, I'll be satisfied. And please, Lion-O, er, Yamenko
does not count. There has to be someone to balance all the faeries, baby
monsters, cute aliens and dancing voodoo dolls. I realize Toriyama, the
creator of The Origial Badass isn't around, but I own the Record of the
Lodoss War. I know Mr. What's-his-name character designer is capable of
thinking up much cooler characters than the cast of loonies I've seen so
far. I mean, Ashram? That guy leaves more Badass on his pillow in the
morning than Bruce Campbell has ever seen.
-KE
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Well, I did just as you said and went to everybody's main man Andrew Vestal, since I haven't as of yet played Chrono Cross. Here's what he had to say:
"In Radical Dreamers, Serge and Kid were joined on their quest by a character named Gil -- a very powerful, masked magician. Later in the game, it was revealed that Gil was actually Mao, or Magus, in disguise. The character of Alf in CC was originally named "Gil" (you can see this by hex editing the demo). But the game developers (rightfully) thought this introduced a continuity problem given Chrono Cross' time period relative to Chrono Trigger, so the character was renamed to Alf, and the connection to Magus was lost. Personality-wise, Alf is still similar to Magus."
So there you have it. Although his name will undoubtedly bring to mind furry extraterrestrials with attitude, there is a character similar to Magus in Chrono Cross.
Simplicity doesn't matter, you say? |
Let me just say that I'm tired of people sending in their thoughts,
opinions, and theories about FFVIII. Frankly, I didn't understand a good 50%
of VIII's plot and reading those letters just make my head hurt more. I
prefer the more old-school RPGs where you are simply assigned to kill this
guy and all of his minions. Granted, it's a bit simplistic, but as long as
it's presented well and has good characters, simplicity doesn't matter, does
it?
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I think that there's plenty of ways to weave an intricate and captivating storyline without it becoming overly complex and difficult to understand. Unfortunately, there are plenty of obstacles to this. FFVII became convoluted to the point where no one could figure out what the hell was going on thanks to the less-than-spectacular translation. FFVIII had to go and mess with that time travel stuff. But I do believe that an engrossing tale is necessary, and simplicity often does hurt the game in the end.
Then again, there are games like Earthbound that show how enjoyable a light-hearted take on the RPG can be, so I'm probably just full of hot air, anyhow.
Let the circumlocutious FFVIII plot explanations begin |
When I first played through FFVIII, I also had the same question in regards
to Ultimecia's motives. However, upon employing a bit of thought for
several hours, I came upon a theory that made enough sense to cause me to no
longer question the matter. The problem here is that Mr./Ms. K is thinking
that in order for the Ellone Machine to work, one must personally "meet"
with another individual. However, in this occasion we are dealing with
sorceresses who pass down their power from one body to another. Let's
suppose that Ultimecia inherited Edea's sorceress power, like so:
Edea -> Sorceress 1 -> Sorceress 2 -> Sorceress 3 -> Ultimecia
Thus, the power that is handed down makes each sorceress part of an entity.
It is because of this that Ultimecia can travel from Sorceress 3, whom she
has met at one time or another in her life, to Sorceress 2, and so on, until
the beginning of time.
Let's add the meeting that Ultimecia and Edea experienced into the equation.
Supposing that the Ellone Machine only imitates Ellone's power, it is
possible that Ultimecia has the ability to possess Edea because the latter
contains part of her. All of the other sorceresses in between did as well,
so it would be possible that Ultimecia could have decided that the control
over each sorceress could simply be attributed to the entity aspect. Thus,
she believes this to be an exception of sorts, and is unaware that she
actually died in the past.
(And just to delve a little further into the storyline, for the fun of
it...)
So why is it that Ultimecia stops at Edea? It is possible that sometime
before Edea there is a schism of sorts in relation to the sorceress
embodiment. Since Ellone is alive in Edea's time period, Ultimecia can make
use of her powers to travel through the sorceresses whose powers Adel had
acquired, and thus travel to the age of the Great Hyne herself to achieve
time compression. Since in this case she would be employing Ellone's actual
powers with no "modification" whatsoever, she would not suspect anything by
not being able to control the sorceresses before Adel's time, and her
presence in the past would simply trigger the desired effect.
While I'm at it, I would like to say that FFIX looks to have the potential
to become the best Final Fantasy ever. Hopefully, however, Square will take
advantage of two things they introduced in VIII and make my wishes come
true. Here's what I'm hoping for:
1) The environments in FFIX look like they could have quite a bit of depth
and history behind them. In FFVIII, for example, each country/location was
given a bit of history by discussing its actions during the Great Sorceress
War, etc. It would be great to see Square take advantage of this once more.
Also, FFVIII featured a name for every single
archipelago/peninsula/mountain range/etc. in the world. It would be simply
stunning to see side-quests being integrated into this, beyond the "go here,
go there" aspect that we were subjected to with the Obel Lake quest in VIII.
For example, say that during a conversation, somebody mentions the 'Great
War' that took place in Mountain X. Later in the game, you could find this
mountain and enter a desolate battle field, where you can find valuable
relics, and maybe even items such as diaries that would provide a glimpse
into the history of the world.
2) Folk legends. Or something which would also provide a glimpse into the
culture of the world. In FFVIII, if you visit the White SeeD ship later in
the game, a cadet will be reading a book to young children on the creation
of the world, and how the Great Hyne was involved; this type of thing adds
such a tremendous amount of depth to the world that you begin to envision
where it is that these characters are actually living. In RPGs, it is
popular to feature development through characters, which are placed upon a
backdrop often referred to as a 'world.' Development in an individual never
occurs through character interaction alone, however. Culture has a lot to
do with it, and the way the world shapes our views is a lot more significant
than how one single individual can.
Regarding the FFVIII question about Ultimecia. She never knew what was
going to happen. She didn't know she'll die etc. That's basically it - For
Ultimecia, the event was futuristic. While she controlled Edea, she
probably didn't have the motivation to probe into Edea's mind and find out
how she got the powers, so she never "remembered" it. She had no way of
knowing of her own demise.
-Zohar Gilboa
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That's a hell of an explanation you've got there, Zohar. I personally feel that Ultimecia was merely controlling Edea rather than probing her mind or anything of that sort. If she were able to examining Edea's mind, she would have understood the true purpose of SeeD, which she obviously did not. So, she was unaware that she would eventually perish due to her own mingling with the past, and in the end Squall and company took her out.
That silly Ultimecia and all of her tricks |
Anyway, after rereading the FF8 email you named as topic a couple of times
and popping a few cold pills to see if that would help comprehension (it
didn't) I think I figured out what he was asking, which would be a good
trick since I haven't even gotten past Lunatic Pandora...
I think K is asking why Ultimecia bothered to take over Edea and attempt
time compression if she already knew she was going to die. The answer is
that she *didn't* know it at the time, and actually couldn't. Let's
consider time from Ultimecia's point of view (as I understand it, anyway.
Watch me make mistakes that come from not having conquered the game. ;).
1) Ultimecia is from the future, such-and-such a year. She creates the
Ellone Machine to send her consciousness through time.
2) Ultimecia sends her mind back into present time to control Edea, who is
at the very least middle-aged at this point and has been in possession of
her powers for quite some time.
3) Ultimecia skips into Rinoa's body, then gets passed to Adel. Or
something. I'm still a little foggy on this.
4) I haven't gotten this far, but at this point I assume we have time
compression after we beat up Adel, which sends us back to some time around
Edea's birth. Or something like that. I gather that she somehow ends up
around that era to pass on her powers.
5) She gets her ass kicked by Squall and Co, and so dies in the past. A
helluva long way before when she started.
Although we see these events as working backwards through chronological
time, Ultimecia experiences it as going forwards. If Ultimecia hadn't died
in the past Edea would never have become a sorceress, which meant that she
would never have fought Squall, which means Rinoa would never have become a
sorceress and no one would have gone back into the past to kill her and
this game would never have had a plot...did you hear that? That was the
sound of my brain snapping like a taunt rubber band as it tries to
comprehend and explain temporal paradox.
Anyway, suffice to say time is like an endless loop -- a lot like this
email. I hope this helped, because now I have to stick my head in the
freezer for a while.
-L.M.
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Were those first two explanations convoluted and abstruse enough for you? Then try this next one on for size.
Or, you know, this could be the explanation, too |
The way I see it they don't want you to think about that at all. It's
kind of like when you learn the song of storms from that windmill guy in the
future, only he learned in the past from you, only you didn't teach him to
him yet, because you had never played it for him. (whew) I figure Ultimaciea
wants time compression because she's a greedy bitch. She was probably just
thinking on that large throne of hers one day, which by the way I am
convinced that every time she wants to get down off of it she summons Griever
to help her (really though, it's like 50 feet tall), anyway, one day she
thought to herself,
"Hmmmm... I rule the world, killed some SeeD people or something, and
built myself a castle, and filled it with some easy monsters ... now what?
Oh I know! I think I'll take over the past or something! That way I can be a
real nasty bitch to everybody!"
So just lighten up! None really cares, except for me, the people at the
GIA, and some people who will write to the GIA, my friends (the smart ones),
some Japanese people, and maybe Squaresoft, some other video game companies
who make RPG's, and people who play FF8, and some other people who I didn't
care to mention.
On a different note, why do you people always write the Roman numerals?
Why don't you just say FF1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9, 10, or 11? Do you think
Squaresoft will come down to the GIA (or up to the GIA, because who really
knows what direction we really are facing in space?) and say,
"Look guys, you're gonna stop shortening our game titles or were gonna
kick your asses!...in court.."
~ODiN
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Actually, we at the GIA use roman numerals because we feel that they make us more elite and elevate us above the common folk. Sure, anybody can say "FF8", but it takes a real intellectual to pound out "FFVIII".
There's more than one way to be an illiterate buffoon |
Ya know what?
I didn't understand FFVIII's plot at all after the first half of disc 3,
but the game still kicked ass. Funny that some games don't make sense until
about that point in the game (about 25 hours, for me at least). Actually,
thats not funny, in fact I don't know if it even makes sense. Damn math
class. Two weeks in to the semester and my brain is already warped...
-Lonely "math illiterate" Swedish
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A lot of RPGs like to keep the player in suspense by waiting until the game has come nearly to a close to bring everything together. This keeps you interested. It makes sense. This reply doesn't, however. My mind has also become warped.
Closing Comments:
Hey, so Vagrant Story got a perfect score in the Famitsu. I was personally already looking forward to the title, but now I'm really anticipating its Western release. How about you guys? What do you think of the game? Was it just an afterthought that paled in comparison to your daydreams of FFIX, only to be brought to the forefront of your attention upon discovering what a high score it had been given? Let me know, okay?
-Drew Cosner
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