Hoimi -
July 24, 2001 - Chris Jones
Disclaimer: The opinions expressed
within this column are those of the participants and the
moderator, and do not necessarily reflect those of the
GIA. There is coarse language and potentially offensive
material afoot.
Sorry old man, but that's just the way that it is, don't bother none...
Don't say we didn't warn you.
I meant to touch on something that Nich said in Saturday's closing remarks, but it slipped my mind yesterday: namely, that I'm somewhat separate from the rest of the staff when it comes to writing the column. It's a true thing, for the most part, and I know it definitely wasn't an accusation or criticism on Nich's part, but I still thought it might deserve some further explanation as far as you readers are concerned.
Basically, it stems from a few key points - I work on a laptop which doesn't always have a net connection, it takes me about 3 hours write the column every day, and nearly any distraction at all (TV, music, IRC) can cause that to balloon up to 4 or 5 hours, which is usually all the time I have on a given evening - all of which make it kind of hard to stay on the staff channel during or after the time I write the col.
Of course, there are more than a few other staffers for whom much that holds true, but everybody has their limit on how much time they can donate, and this is mine. On the other hand, as Nich pointed out, there are some advantages as to the way it works out. Nich called me an ombudsman, but I think that's actually backwards to a degree: DA often tends to be more fanatical about certain issues than the rest of the staff, and this gives the staff as a whole a certain degree of plausible deniablity when I go off on an anti-old school rant or something. Still, I'm extremely proud to be associated with the site, regardless of how closely DA's tied in to the rest of the staff, and I hope to continue to be so for some time to come.
Onward.
Message in a bottle |
Despite my backlog of unplayed PSX rpg's not to
mention my unhappy lack of money, I've considered
buying a GBC just for the DWIII remix. The one that
explained the origin of Erdrick (no, not Loto.
ERDRICK, I say) was my first rpg and it made my state
of mind so weird that, on my second of many plays
through, I actually lingered around the hero's house
in Aliahan, selecting "TALK" to the hero's mother
repeatedly right after defeating Baramos, trying
obsessively to send her a psychic farewell message
because it was just breaking my heart to know that
once I stepped into that pit to the Dark World, the
hero would never get another chance to speak to his
moms again.
Still, the greatest DW of all time has to be 4. The
story and map were just epic, and Necrosaro had to be
the first video game villain I'd ever seen with a
personality and motivations. But it was the awesome
AI and team command option, not to mention the
backstories for each party member and the strangely
characteristic behaviors they would exhibit if you
cast the CHANCE spell, that created this really strong
illusion that the hero's allies were . . . well, real.
Now try and name an FF that's done that.
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It's probably a measure of how strongly involved I was in games (and how uninvolved I am now) that I've done the same thing in other games as what Nameless Guy describes above in DQIII. People talk about wanting more freedom in games, but it always seemed wrong to me that you could just walk away from things that any reasonable person would say or do, so almost compulsively I made sure Erdrick talked to his mom, Yang talked to his wife, etc.
And that's actually a big part of what makes the early DQ games so playable (or not playable), as the next letter touches on...
Gotta get me that Magic Armor |
My favorite must be the first one. Granted, that is the only one I really gave anytime to, but it was my first rpg. Back when I didn't even know what an rpg was, and getting enough money to buy that awesome new sword and armor was all the motivation I needed to devote hours to leveling up. Thank God it isn't like that anymore...well, most of the time.
katarac
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For me, this letter pretty much hits on the main reason why early RPGs are playable or not playable: a willingness to become involved in the game. From the right angle, I actually really enjoyed the first DQ, because it was so bright and colorful and at the time it seemed pretty damn important that you get such and such piece of equipment, or raise your levels enough to get a new spell - even if the actual levelling-up wasn't fun, the feeling of accomplishment was. I remember a mini DQ strategy guide Nintendo Power once had (well before the DQ giveaway) which had detailed drawings of the various weapons and armor, which made acquiring said junk that much more interesting, because it all looked so damn cool to a junior high kid.
The problem is, there are limits as to how long you can take such things so seriously. As I got older it took more and more to keep me interested, partly because I'd done it all before and partly because other games were offering more, plot wise. And once the actual act of getting a new weapon or a new level lost interest, so did the process of levelling up. I dunno, maybe I'm just jaded, but at this point I feel pretty well past the point where I can really enjoy an old-style DQ game the way I used to, which is why I've kept clear of the GBC remixes.
Remember this? |
The subject of what is my favorite Dragon Quest game is a tough one. The choices are limited to the first 4 games in the series and the Gameboy Dragon Warrior Monsters, of course, because I do not understand Japanese.
Of these five then, I'd have to say it's either Dragon Warrior 3 or the original Dragon Warrior.
Dragon Warrior 3 I got way back when I was still in Middle School. It remains one of my favorite RPGs, even today. Heck, I'd be willing to bet that it's in my NES right now.
There's something nostalgic about the game for me -- I remember hours of smashing Metal Slimes and those purple monkeys outside of Dharma Shrine, trying to get my stupid Cleric up high enough so I could class-change her to a mage and make a poor man's Sage. (Sages being the DQ equivilant of Red Wizards)
I remember going to fight the last boss and getting my butt kicked for weeks on end, until I figured out the tricks to beating him.
I remember the absolute shock that went through me when I saw my team first emerge into the Tintangel countryside.
I remember killing my first Metal Babble, and the hollering I let out when I saw the EXP they gave.
I remember hours on end of playing the game, more or less over an entire summer, just because I wanted to hit Level 99. (I never did. It takes a LOT of EXP to do. I'd imagine you could if you played for like a year straight, but other than that...)
I remember days of searching out that last orb, sailing from one continent to another looking EVERYWHERE. (This was before GameFAQs took all the challenge out of games.)
The game just.. has it all. Class changes, a storyline that was just amazing, day and night (with differing townspeople and monster encounters at night), and hidden stuff out the wazoo. (Like the bathing suit armors for female characters) Especially with the classes, it's a game you can play anytime and still get a new experience.
I had played other RPGs before, but DW3-NES was the first one that really got me "into it." Like I was a questing hero, adventuring to save the world from evil.
For me, there's no better game. Dragon Quest 3 remains the definition of what a good RPG should strive to be.
The only game to come close to it is Chrono Trigger, and Chrono Trigger had part of the same team that made Dragon Quest 3 working on it. Specifically, Yuji Horii (did much of the story) and Akira Toriyama (did the graphics and monster designs) Yuji Horii and Akira Toriyama have played the same roles in DragonQuest games since the first one way back at the dawn of time -- which is one of the strengths of the series, I think. Both of them are talented beyond words. :)
[KiTA]
....Eagerly awaiting DW4/5/6-GBA....
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Obviously others feel differently than I do about what still makes DQ playable though - the above letter says that so well that there's not really much more to say. Other than that, I actually would very much like to see what Enix's English translation of DQ 5 and 6 would look like, although it's disappointing that I can't go back in time and play them back to back with contemporary RPGs like FF5 and 6 in order to judge how they really stacked up against each other.
Pretentious as heck... no wait, that's someone else... |
Okay, all I really have to say in this letter is that you asked us to discuss
our favorite Dragon Quest game, but then you say to make it our "favorite NES
one or GBC remix" Wow, there are Dragon Quest games on the NES and GBC? Are
you one of those cool people that try to sound smart by calling the American
series Dragon Warrior by its Japanese name, Dragon Quest, when the series
are, while the same game, completly different in almost all aspects of
translation, and sometimes, even gameplay? Sounds like it.
Colin Moriarty
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Me, trying to sound smart? Perish the thought.
Look, I use Japanese and US names pretty much interchangeably, and don't particularly care if this offends anyone's sense of accuracy. I'll say Threads of Fate one sentence and Dewprism the next, big freakin' deal. As for Dragon Warrior / Quest, yes, they have different translations, especially with the NES "Middle Ages" speak. The infamous Puff-puff sequences were removed, and there were some graphic alterations, although the US NES games look considerably better than the original Japanese MSX versions, if I remember right. Beyond that, though, they are the same games, and as everybody pretty much knows, the series would have been called Dragon Quest over here too if it weren't for some preexisting D&D copyright issues, which makes the debate fairly meaningless.
Besides, you yourself refer to the series as "Dragon Warrior/Quest" in
your own FAQ, so get off your goddamned high horse already.
More copyright issues |
Dragon Quest 3 Remix for GBC is by far the best incarnation of the series.
If you would have asked the same question a year ago, the answer would have
been DQ3 for NES. The remixed version is easily the best "reincarnation" of
a game ever done, and that's taking Mario Allstars into account. The main
reason I like the game is also my biggest complaint about the series, its a
complete, obvious rip-off of all things Ultima. Sure, most Japanese RPG's
are Ultima ripoffs in one way or another, but this game is stealing
everything from map tiles to the "questions at the start that determine
your fate" thing! Even the character designs for your party members are a
bit too similar to the character designs in Ultima 3,4 and 5.
Like I said though, those similarities are also the main thing I like about
the game, since the Ultima games (at least up until 7) are the very
definition of computer/console RPGs.
If you have any doubt, go ahead and compare screenshots from Dragon Quest
1-4 with screenshots of Ultima 1-5. There's no way its a coincidence,
someone at Enix played Ultima and liked it so much, he made his own....
Regards,
John N.
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There's more than a few similarities between DQ and Wizardy as well, although fans might use the term "homage" or "streamlining" rather than "rip-off". There's also the argument that while Ultima is the very definition of computer RPGs (or was, at one point), it's not the definition of console RPGs, and hasn't been for a while, in part because of the touches and characterizations that DQ and its descendants brought to the genre - common ancestor, divergent evolution. Still, good point.
What is it with you people anyway? |
I'd have to say my favorite Dragon Warrior title (of the ones I've played) would have to be the brand new DW3 on GBC remix. It seems like Enix finally achieved the level of customization they've been trying for since the very first game in the series. This is because the personality system mixed with the class-changing gives it sort of a "pen and paper-esque" feel. It seems like I control my party's destiny, instead of just leading them through endless leveling sessions.
They also managed to make leveling up...well not "fun". I guess they made it un-boring. With the new medal collecting system, I can think of which monster medals I need to find, instead of thinking about how many hours have passed since my last gain in strength. And the monsters FINALLY animate!!! How cool is THAT?
I'm looking forward to DW7, if only because I'll get to do all this fun customization in a brand-spanking-new world (I played the original NES Dragon Warriors long ago), which will likely send me spiraling into a beautiful coma.
So...why doesn't the GIA staff seem to adore the Dragon Warrior games?
-Tomm
|
Well, because of the same things I talked about in intro, you can't really treat "the GIA staff" as a single entity, as the next letter shows pretty well. Still, I think it can be pretty well summed up this way: in the current console RPG world, you've got your early DQs on one side of the spectrum, and stuff like FF8 and Vagrant Story on the other. While it's not impossible to enjoy both equally, it does tend to be the case that most gamers will prefer one or the other, and a good chunk of GIA staffers tend to drift one way - take a wild guess as to which way that is.
GIA and DQ... can you feel the love? |
It's been years since I've played it and the specific details are fuzzy, but
my favorite DW game has to be IV. It took the deep gameplay that began with
II and III and finally wedded it to an interesting storyline told in
unrelated chapters which eventually came together for the finale. It also
introduced neat concepts like a benevolent slime in your party and an entire
chapter about what it's like to be run your own item shop in this sort of
world, going about the world hunting for the best goods to attract the most
customers. I never finished it at the time, since I was playing a friend's
copy, but of all the potential games in the series for Enix to remake on a
handheld, I only have eyes for this one.
-Nich Maragos
|
I was putting this up mostly to dispel the notion that all GIA staff hated DQ (again, not true: this was a completely unsolicited letter on Nich's part) but this and another letter reminded me of the entire Taloon sequence, which is still one of the most innovative things the series (and most RPGs) have ever done, as far as breaking out of the "swords and sorcery" groove. Still, it's somewhat disappointing that the way to maintain an items shop has less to do with careful inventory and supplier relations, and more to do with hands-on treasure hunting.
No, really, I'm serious.
Pot city |
Guess what, Chris?
I actually own at least one version of every Dragon Quest game.
(Waits for applause to die down., dodges the odd rotten-fruit projectile.)
Thank you, thank you. My favorite, by far, is Dragon Warrior IV which I believe to be the best NES game, period. I also thoroughly enjoyed DQ VI, even despite only knowing enough Japanese to be able to read the item names. Well, that is until I loaned it to my friend who, knowing even less Japanese than me, inadvertently deleted my 80+ hour save file I'd used to beat the ultra-hard bonus dungeon. Alas...
I bought DQ VII for $30 from a Japanese video rental store, but I haven't bothered playing it much since it'll be coming out here anyway. I don't want to give away too much here but, get this, you can PICK UP AND THROW POTS! Now that's innovation, baby!!
El Cactuar
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I've been hearing about this game for years, I played it at E3, but for the life of me I just can't get that excited about it. Still, I intend to pick it up when it's released in the US, just to see if the great white hope of old school RPGs can unseat the FF memetic virus from my mind.
Do it yourself |
Chris,
Despite enjoying Dragon Quest 1-3, and the Remix of 1 and 2 on GameBoy
Color (I haven't played 3's remix yet), I have to say I have a different
favorite. A friend of mine, out of complete boredom, developed something
called Dragon Warrior Minus, which was a short Dragon Quest spinoff for the
TI-83+ (I think, it's been a while), graphing calculator.
Sure, the graphics sucked, and the story was pretty lame, and it was
nowhere near official, but I got to play Dragon Quest during my Physics class
while looking like doing work, and that's what it's all about, right? Right.
Mike Drucker
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I admire your friend's determination and creativity, although I'm also reminded of Thoreau's line about quiet desperation - that pretty much always summed up my high school experience, in retrospect, especially when it came to playing games in class.
Even in deep space, it's just too hot over the equator |
Personally, I'm very interested in how exactly you
managed to place a satellite in geosynchonous orbit
directly over any location not on the equator.
Kirijini
|
Two ways: really cool people don't have to obey the laws of physics, and whenever that line of solipsism fails, we break out the agrav fabric from A Fire Upon the Deep.
And I'm ending this line of inquiry now, before anyone asks how we get the fabric working this deep in the Slow Zone.
Closing Comments:
I think it's about time for some Zelda: Oracles discussion, don't you? See you then.
-Chris Jones, out of words to say for now
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